Jess Gaedeke (00:00)
Okay, cool. And I think we're good. Okay, so we will go ahead and kick off. Hi, everybody. Welcome to the Dig In podcast. I am so excited about this. I've been looking forward to this because Ronda and I have worked together for many years, going way, back longer than we will admit. So we're not going to talk numbers. But today I am joined by Ronda Slaven, VP Market Insights and Competitive Intelligence at Synchrony. Thank you. Thank you for being here. I'm so excited to have you.

Ronda Slaven (00:29)
Thank you for having me. I'm excited too. It's been forever. I'm excited we can catch up.

Jess Gaedeke (00:33)
I know, I know. Again, no numbers, right? We're going to keep it up.

Ronda Slaven (00:36)
We won't talk about that. Experience. We'll just say experienced. ⁓

Jess Gaedeke (00:40)
I

like that synonym for age. That's wonderful. ⁓ So I'm going to get going with an impromptu question ⁓ just to kind of kick us off today. So what was your very first job in life? I'm talking like back in the day, what was your very first thing that you got paid to do?

Ronda Slaven (00:55)
Very first thing I got paid to do. Well, there's the quintessential babysitting, but actually my first, I would say real job was my ⁓ father owned a pizza place on Ohio State campus. So ⁓ I probably bus tables and wash dishes from the age of 10. And yeah, probably wasn't on the official payroll, but you know, kind of had to clean the tables and do whatever job he wanted me to do. And when your father owns it.

you go in when he wants you to go in and you work as many hours as he wants you to. So, really jumped right into kind of that food service aspect, but it was a great learning experience.

Jess Gaedeke (01:33)
Yeah, well, a hustle culture to start, probably some also free pizza as a little added perk. I was also a pizza gal, Red Boy Pizza, how may I help you? I answered lots of phone calls that way.

Ronda Slaven (01:45)
Very good experience to have.

Jess Gaedeke (01:49)
So I'll ask you another one and then again, we can decide which one you like. ⁓ So I'm just going to throw a quick impromptu question at you. What's an easy item on your bucket list that you haven't gotten to yet?

Ronda Slaven (02:01)
An easy item on my bucket list. I've been to many national ⁓ parks and I have not been to Yosemite. It's one of the gaps in my bucket list. I don't know if Instagram knows this or if I clicked a few things, but all of a sudden I'm getting a lot of Yosemite, ⁓ you know, social media posts pop up. So think it's the universe saying, okay, next year, put it on your list, plan for it. But I've been to almost all the other ones. So I'm excited to finally get there.

Jess Gaedeke (02:28)
Very cool. And yes, the internet knows, now you will be reminded even more. That's the way the universe

Ronda Slaven (02:33)
That'll really know.

Jess Gaedeke (02:36)
So

tell us a little bit about your background and where you are now.

Ronda Slaven (02:40)
So I think, you know, the best term to kind of summarize my background is research nerd. You know, I think a lot of us in the industry kind of give ourselves that, that, that title. I'm definitely fall in the camp of research nerd. First and foremost though, like mother of two, my oldest daughter just graduated college this past weekend. So that's, know, that's the, the bigger personal life. But from a career perspective, I've been in the market research industry for 25 years.

nearly 25 years. And ⁓ yeah, I started out as an anthropology degree, just love that whole idea of studying cultural, studying humans, understanding what makes people tick, and started out on the focus group facility side right out of college, joined a focus group facility and kind of manage that aspect of things. You learn quickly about why data quality and recruiting is so important.

Learn about client service. There's no better place to learn than you know on the supplier side, especially in the qualitative area then to ⁓ You know dive right into the client service aspect and then I've had you know, kind of a progressive career I've had roles at bread financial I've had roles at General Electric and Heinz So I've gotten a nice variety of consumer packaged goods on the financial services side in the credit card industry

Each role I've learned a ton as I've gone along, ⁓ learned kind of, you know, rolling up the sleeve and diving into different research all the way to team leadership. And as of late, I manage a team of about 10 people at Syncring. And we do all things market research, consumer insights, B2B research, as well as competitive intelligence and thought leadership as we think about how we promote our brand in the market.

So yeah, I've had a really fun career. It's not over yet. I hope there's a long runway ahead. don't think you can take the research nerd out of me no matter how I progress and how old I get. ⁓ But yeah, it's just really fun and I've had a great career and love the team I have now love what we're doing and really just excited to talk research. You know, that's why when you asked me I said sure I'll go and talk research. Why not?

Jess Gaedeke (04:52)
Yeah, well, let's dig in. Let's do that because you just mentioned something that I think is a story you're going to talk to us about, which is the idea of thought leadership. So to set the stage, Rhonda, our listeners really do crave inspiration from hearing from leaders. And I think one of the best ways to inspire is to tell a story. And one of the things that you have as part of your background is you are super integral in the launch of this thought leadership series to promote synchrony as an expert to your partner industries. And so I think a lot of our listeners

either aspire to spearhead some of this thought leadership or would love to learn from that. So take us to the beginning of this story. How did that idea originate? What inspired the idea of let's really create this thought leadership series and content?

Ronda Slaven (05:36)
Yeah, I we have to go all the way back to 2012, really. And so almost 13 years now, we started this program. And it started because, you know, talking to different cross-functional people in the business, at the time, we had a platform that was really focused on big ticket purchases and how the consumer can finance and pay for those purchases. And we supported many different industries and we still do today, like flooring, furniture, jewelry.

lawn mowers, all that great stuff, but the common denominator is they're all large purchases that people, you know, save up for, they need to finance. It's usually more of a need-based purchase. And at the time, we were making a lot of kind of assumptions about how the consumer shopped for those purchases. And we had a lot of knowledge gaps. We had a long list of hypotheses, but it became clear when I joined the business that they were assumptions. We didn't really know how the consumer was shopping.

At that time, the other thing that was going on in 2012, 2013 was that was really the apex of when the digital world was shifting from a shopper journey perspective. And so even if you thought you knew something, it was changing so rapidly that we realized we had a lot of knowledge gaps. So it started out as a piece of research where we were trying to address those assumptions and hypotheses to say, how does the shopper, when they're thinking about big ticket, really mapping out their path to purchase?

But looking at it, where there's moments of truth for where they're researching payment products or financing, but also where can we help them along that journey? And it evolved more into, well, how we're learning a lot about the full shopping experience that we're seeing as a knowledge gap among our partner base. They didn't have research like that. And when we went to share it, when we got the first year away data back, it was a knowledge gap they had. And so then we realized there's something here. There's something to this, right?

And so we actually did the study and we dove into 14 different categories. So we built a pack to purchase for furniture. We built one for flooring. We built one for all these different categories. And we looked for what are the common themes. And believe it or not, there was actually a ton of common themes because if you look at it from us, the shopper, we're consumers too, right? It's what we find over the years is that it's more about the amount they're spending is driving the purchase behavior and the shopping behavior.

more so than whether it's a sofa or it's a treadmill. It's like, if I'm spending $1,000, I'm going to do my due diligence. And it's often similar steps in that path to purchase. But there were also differences. So it was a challenge in the fact that we wanted to find that overarching story for Synchrony. What are the big insights and how we can position ourselves as experts in the big ticket financing space?

But also what are the nuances and then how do we take those to each individual 14 industry and show up and say, hey, Synchrony has the thought leadership. We understand how your shoppers are shopping sometimes better than you do because they didn't have these insights and tailoring the presentation. So even though you started centrally, now you've created almost 14 different thought leadership series. And so that's how it started really was just, you know, an unmet need.

a lot of assumptions, no data to back it up type of thing. And the very first thing we did in 2012 was shop alongs in every category. So it was a massive effort. And now what we do is we repeat it every other year, just quantitatively. ⁓ But 13 years later, it's still running because people value it so much.

Jess Gaedeke (09:11)
Yeah, my gosh. I mean, the things that you must have seen across that 13 years as well in terms of some of the shifts in different categories, but did you have to leverage any kind new way of thinking? So you talked about breaking it down across those 14, but still having some kind of macro points to the journey. Did you have to stretch your thinking and your framework and how you approach the research?

Ronda Slaven (09:33)
definitely. And it kind of got added on over time because everyone wanted in when they saw the first like 12 categories and everyone wanted in on it. So not only do we have to literally expand the research, but we also had to draw a little bit of boundaries to around, you know, we can't we can't also go so nuanced by every category that the questions are tailored for all 14 categories. Right. So that in general was a challenge. Now we have a good rhythm, obviously.

but just making sure that it's broad enough and deep enough, the bandwidth to be able to go super deep on every single category just isn't there. So when you're developing thought leadership, it's a very fine line, especially when you're presenting it at a conference of home furnishings, know, merchants, or you're presenting at a home improvement conference, they obviously want to go deeper because that's the world they live in. And so it's a very fine balance of finding that match for where the insights can add value, but also being transparent that I don't know that.

Let's follow up, see if we can help you with that. So that's been kind of one of the challenges is it did go deep and specific, but I think, you know, it's evolved so much now that people would love even more. And so it's just, you know, it's a, it's a resource issue at that point. And where do you, where, does that value shift start coming down the backside of that curve? ⁓ so yeah, that was just some of the challenges we've had to shift digitally. Like I said, as we think about how people shop in a path to purchase, it's not linear.

Right. And so with the introduction of so many digital experiences now, we almost see consumers doing more of a loop, right? It's not a path and then purchase. It's a loop. And so we had to start even thinking about the number of steps on the journey and how we present it and the number of ways that we share it, what goes on that journey. So for example, in probably around 2017 or so, we had to start adding steps in that said, I'm

asking social media references for feed for input, right? We didn't think about that in 2012. It was more traditional back then. So it's definitely has evolved for sure.

Jess Gaedeke (11:36)
That's one of the things I was going to ask about. So that's interesting. It's that ⁓ with just the advances, especially if you think about now the role of AI and helping consumers sort through information or they're served up information, are you going to continuously evolve and sort of map that journey with the modernization that sort of is necessitated?

Ronda Slaven (11:56)
Absolutely. And we did start in the last wave in 2023. We started to dip our toe a little bit in the AI conversation. This wave around later this year, it's definitely a topic we're going to have to dive into is how can AI... Well, you're really trying to figure out where is it a helpful tool and where is it potentially a hindrance in that process. And I don't know what I don't know yet at this point, so I just have hypotheses. But even in the last six months, you're seeing a proliferation of...

retail shopping tools that are AI driven that are helping the consumer. So are they using it? Is this more, you know, company noise at this point to look innovative, but are the consumers actually using it in their shop or germing? Or is it more, ⁓ you know, a few years out in terms of adoption? So this will probably, ⁓ just to your point, be the first time we really dive into that. So I'm looking forward to seeing what we're going to learn.

Jess Gaedeke (12:48)
Yeah, so interesting. I'm picturing some apps that you can place furniture in your room, right? With a photo and stuff like that. And I'm curious, excuse me, Emma, you're gonna have to edit that little cop out. Okay, yeah, I'm like. ⁓ And I'm curious ⁓ if that technology will actually lead to maybe a bigger ticket price. ⁓ Sorry, let me say it again.

Ronda Slaven (13:00)
I'll take a drink while you're doing that.

Jess Gaedeke (13:16)
I'm actually curious if those technologies will lead to a bigger buy from that consumer, or maybe they'll actually purchase additional items because you can place other things in the frame. I'm really curious how it's going to shape out to some of the buying dynamics and some of the sort of cross-selling that might even be available or sort of spearheaded. So I don't know, it's fascinating to think about. So I'll be curious to read the report after you do this year and moving forward.

Ronda Slaven (13:41)
Yeah, there's a lot digital tools and our consumers overwhelmed by all the tools and choices, right? Sometimes we see in research, you know, it's kind of that whole habit loop forming behavioral sciences. Sometimes you see that if you cross that threshold of too many choices, they just go back to the traditional decision. They kind of simplify themselves. And so I do wonder if we're at a bit of that point where it's just so much out there or they're simplifying it so much that they're just looking for a recommendation.

AI recommends something and then they just decide. So we also track the total length of time from the time that they say they're interested in starting to shop to the time they actually make the purchase. And we've tracked that timeframe by category for the last 13 years. We have seen it getting shorter. Like it's not so much that people are being decisive. I think it is more the tools helping them get to that decision faster. So to your point, it'll be really interesting to see what the results show this year.

Jess Gaedeke (14:35)
Yeah, fascinating. can't wait to see that. when do you or let me say it this way. I'm really all over the place today. How do you judge the success of something like a thought leadership series? Like when do you know that this was really a powerful thing for you to do that added value?

Ronda Slaven (14:56)
would say it was probably the third year we did it when people just came knocking on the door, internally and externally, right? To the point where six months before we even were kicking off the next wave, people were saying, when's that new one coming out? Do we have new data? You my partners are asking for it. They love it. And then you start to see this kind of growing group of people that are coming every year. And so it was really, it took a year or two, education, sharing, tweaking, adding. And then once we got in this rhythm,

and we started taking it out to partners and sharing it some of their events and their conferences and getting some press around it, it did start to snowball. And that's where even 13 years later now, we have an internal intelligence platform at Synchrony where we house all of our research and anyone in the company can access it. And to this day, 13 years later, it's still the number three most searched item in our Intel portal or downloaded item. And so that tells you it's still very relevant, still in demand.

⁓ We also mark certain content externally ready to share, and so we see that people are downloading that for external sharing. We also measure through traditional methods. So we'll measure media impressions if our comms team is pushing something out through social and ⁓ quoting it back to that study or linking it back to that study that lives on our website. We'll look at website impressions. We have tracked ⁓ audience sizes from a physical impression. So if we go to a partner's

⁓ annual conference, like some of our flooring partners have big annual conferences, you know, that audience size, how many people are there. So we try to quantify the impact as much as we can. ⁓ Some years it's easier than others, some years it's more word of mouth and a little bit more qualitative, but we do try to track that and so we can understand the impact we're having.

Jess Gaedeke (16:46)
Yeah, sounds like you're kind of a research nerd about it, if I'm honest.

Ronda Slaven (16:49)
Little bit, little bit, yeah.

Jess Gaedeke (16:51)
Sorry, not sorry about that. So what's your biggest

Ronda Slaven (16:54)
Ultimately,

to add on that too, as I was thinking through as I was answering you, we also, at the end of the day, you're trying to demonstrate your expertise in our partner's industries. What we're trying to achieve is that they trust us, they trust that we know their industry and they want to partner with us. So it comes back to business development and prospecting, as well as partner stickiness. We want to retain our partners. We want them to think that they're getting more insights and value from us than they get from other...

know, finance partners in the market. So we also will think about it from a business development perspective. And when I hear things like, I used your research in a pitch to a new partner last week and they really thought it was great, you know, so we also are thinking about it from a true, are we driving, you know, insights in the business development process? And that's the, to me, the true measurement of what we're driving.

Jess Gaedeke (17:46)
Yeah. Yeah. When the rubber meets the road, if what you're providing can help with that conversion and in the market with your customers, that's there's nothing better, right? It's fine. So great experience, great lessons. What's your overall biggest takeaway from this experience in this thought leadership series that you're still leading?

Ronda Slaven (18:04)
So yeah, the biggest lesson I would say for me and the team is it's all about consistency. It's like consistency, consistency, consistency. I think as research professionals, we are very curious people. And so we'll do a piece of research and it'll be great. Maybe we turn it into a few year tracking study, but we're kind of on to the next big, brightest thing, the next shiny object, the next new tech, the new trend in the market. And we still have to do all those things too, right? But

Someone once said to me, know, there's some stat or quote that you have to tell someone something like six or seven times before they remember it. And this study has proven that out. I think the consistency of every year, you know, going out, running it, delivering at the same time, having a consistent approach. I mean, I've even toyed with, you know, we want to keep every year we keep it up to date and we keep it fresh and we look at it from new angles. But every year we're like, should we do things differently? Should we just drop it and see if people notice, you know, kind of.

deprivation therapy, right? And every year people still want it. And so I think that when you've built that momentum, in a way it almost to a researcher who's always geeked out on the new thing, it almost feels boring to us, dare I say, right? Because you're like, it's the same thing. But it just shows that when you find something that's truly valuable to the business, to sales, to marketing, just being that drumbeat to where now everybody collectively knows it.

It takes so much work to get to the point where a large organization holistically is aware of something you're doing. mean, most research departments struggle so much with that. You know, it's like, why don't they know we just did that? We had eight webinars and why did they come? You know, and so you just have to be that drumbeat. And I think from an external thought leadership perspective to almost like not democratizing it, but taking the handcuffs off of it a little bit and saying,

Yeah, it's synchrony. You you don't want to be protective of your own IP and your own thought leadership. But really, a few years into it, saying, no, let's partner with our partners. It's OK if our partner wants to slap their logo on it and get us up on stage and take half the credit. Let them have credit, because if that's what is going to get us to be at the hip with them and to grow those relationships, then we all win. And that's what we're in it together. So I think it's the consistency. I think it's just making sure that we're

We're really thinking about what thought leadership can do for us broadly. ⁓ But yeah, that'd be a few of my key learnings. I probably talk about it all day though.

Jess Gaedeke (20:33)
Some of you're not right because you definitely, you you spearheaded it and have seen it this far along. So excellent story. Thank you for sharing that. We're going to turn now to you, Rhonda, as a thought leader in your industry and your organization. And you have a really passionate point of view about the insights industry and the fact that we're at a little bit of a crossroads right now. So I'd love for you to tell me about that crossroads.

Ronda Slaven (20:57)
Yeah, and I think perhaps a lot of your listeners might also resonate with this. I would in some ways hope so. Or they're feeling this or seeing this as well. But I do think that the insights industry right now, I've definitely lost a few hours of sleep in the last few months over this, would say, is at a crossroads. As a career researcher and a research nerd, I am passionate about protecting our industry and thinking about the future of our industry.

And so I think we're at a crossroads where we have several confounding factors. One could argue almost like the perfect storm, right? We have what most people should know, there's data quality issues happening right now. We can all debate around what's driving it. I'm looking at it from a corporate research lens. ⁓ There's some news last few weeks that wasn't great. Some of us are seeing and feeling it in our projects and our data. ⁓

When we think about respondent quality, panel quality, fraud, bots, all those great things, I think we have to take all that seriously as an industry on the client side too. I just read a really interesting take from someone on LinkedIn earlier today. And it was a good perspective to say too, what role does the client side researcher play in that? You know, we've always been doing these long surveys and demanding things cheaper and don't want to pay for panel sample over a certain CPI, right?

It was actually an interesting take because I think a lot about from a corporate researcher, think the industry needs to get their stuff together. But what role do we play in that, right? And driving to where we are as an industry. ⁓ So I think what's happening with fraud, I think what's happening with data quality and sampling, we all need to be very on top of. I think the other thing we see going on is, you know, Google last year put out their new Gmail spam policy.

which is impacting ability to get client list sample through, right? Because it's hitting, you know, it's hitting those sample. And if you need to do a blind study, like a brand study or something like that, you almost can't get through at all. studies are taking longer. It's costing more, you know, it's just, and this is all in the last 18 months. ⁓ And so it's a lot of those different things happening at once. ⁓ We also then have AI.

So it's like in comes AI and AI is a potential great efficiency play. It's a great ⁓ benefit to all of our industry. And I see this as a positive thing actually, but I do think as researchers, we have to be very knowledgeable and also very helpful to our businesses in terms of what's the appropriate use when it comes to market research and where are the watch outs and be honest and transparent about that. And I think it's moving so fast.

that I worry that some researchers and some departments aren't keeping up enough to be able to educate their businesses. So I see it as a great thing. I'm very positive about AI. think it's going to have a great impact on us long-term, but I do worry that it's moving a little faster than a lot of the researchers in the industry are able to keep up with. So at the end of the day, I think we all probably need to roll up our sleeves on both sides of the coin, on the supplier side, on the panel sample side, on the corporate researcher side.

and not just assume that someone's taking care of it, we have to take care of it. And so I think that's kind of why there's a lot of conversation, but are we taking it seriously? And I know we've been partnering with Melanie at Insights Association very closely over the last few months. She's a great advocate. That whole team is doing a lot of great work and they are taking all this seriously. So we just need to all partner together to figure it out. But unfortunately, I think we are at kind of a, you know, perfect storm if we don't

take it seriously and really stay on top of it, it's gonna almost get out of our hands, because it's moving pretty fast.

Jess Gaedeke (24:55)
I'm so glad you gave a shout out to Melanie and Insights Association. We're also a part of that and a big part of the conversation. But I also really appreciate acknowledging some of the commentary around how each of us plays a role. And if clients have had historically maybe certain demands and have sort of pushed the industry to a certain expectation of quality and the price associated with that.

it is an interesting demand environment to then try to change. And so it is going to take all of us. It's going to take the panels figuring it out, suppliers that know how to use the right methodologies with the right data sources, and then clients who will still get great insights, but maybe there's going to be some compromises along the way for making sure we do not sacrifice quality because at the end of the day, what are we reporting on if we don't have that?

Ronda Slaven (25:48)
And there's enough noise out there in the ecosystem that we don't need to add to that. We also don't need to be taken down by that noise either. We need to rise above it and be that positive light. So I think that's what I would encourage all researchers on any end of the spectrum to think about.

Jess Gaedeke (26:04)
Yeah, I love that. You're a great advocate for that. ⁓ What tools and approaches are you using or experimenting with that you're finding value in?

Ronda Slaven (26:14)
Well, there's so much out there right now. So as I mentioned earlier, we do have an internal intelligence platform. We partner with a company called Aurora. We love it. We are working with them right now to think about how we can integrate AI into that platform so that we can make internal search much easier, ⁓ get the right insights in the right people's hands much faster. So we're really excited about that. The other thing that we're working on as a team, as I mentioned, is we have a of a traditional

primary research side of my team, we have thought leadership, and then we have competitive intelligence. you know, historically, we are one team, but we've kind of operated a little bit in silos. And so one of the things that we're trying to do in the last 18 months, 24 months is how do we show up in a more consultative way collectively as a team when projects come in or we need to consult on something? So we're putting together a little bit of a shift in process and toolbox right now to think about

almost like a different intake process. I know that sounds technical, but how do we, when a project request comes in, collectively as a leadership team, assess projects coming in and bring in our CI team to something that maybe on paper looks like it doesn't need competitive intelligence at all, but let's all be looking at all the requests that we have visibility. So we're changing some process things, bringing some new like intake kind of form process things.

just because ultimately we want to be that consultative partner. And we do a really good job of that, but I think there's an opportunity to be even better and be even more strategic if we can kind of say, I know you're asking for this, but what about this too, right? What about this? And you're not gonna do it for everything. There's only so many hours in the day and we're not really trying to sign up for a hundred more projects. We're busy enough, but we do wanna kind of change a little bit about the tools and the processes to kind of almost force that strategic.

alignment and just show we can say we want to be more consultative. I know a lot of research, you know, teams struggle with this and we can say that we have the skill to do all those things, but sometimes you just have to change the process to make it work to kind of force yourself out of your comfort zone. So we're kind of undergoing some things there that I think are going to be really successful. So I'm excited about those.

Jess Gaedeke (28:30)
Yeah, well, experimentation is key and, you know, being willing to shake things up, which I know you're really good at. So what's your hot take on the future of the financial services industry? I've been so excited to ask you this.

Ronda Slaven (28:43)
I don't know how hot it is, yeah, my hot take would be, you know, it's a really fast paced changing industry. ⁓ I compare it to like trying to stand up in flood waters. You you think you finally got your feet underneath you and it just knocks you right back down and you got to start over and try to stand up again. So the competitive landscape is fast moving every day. There's new players popping up, new tools, new products.

AI is starting to even ⁓ embed in the conversation in terms of the shopper journey and payments. But I think if I look down the road, let's say a decade from now, which is not that far, because things move fast. But if I think even down a decade from now, I think things are going to look much different. mean, people fundamentally are still going to need to gain access to money through loans and lending. they're still going to.

need to pay for things when there's times when they don't have that funds available or they don't want to touch their savings because they make a great annual percentage rate off of that. So they're still going to have a need for lending and for borrowing and for access to money. They're still going to make payments, right? So these things are still going to happen, but how it happens I think will look dramatically different. ⁓ I think we've talked for years about biometrics as an industry.

Will 10 years from now, it'll finally be more ubiquitous, it'll finally be more adopted. Perhaps we won't have plastic anymore, it'll all be digital or thumbprint. ⁓ I think when you think about pay by bank and buy now pay later and some of these digital tools, it's just different, right? And if that has evolved that much in 10 years, think about what 10 years from now is gonna look like. So the fundamentals of people needing money.

and need to lean on partners to help them secure those funds, that's not gonna change. But how they pay, I think will look much different. Even thinking about what we call stored value products, right? You have all this money sitting on your Starbucks card that just sits there. Venmo, right? Your friends pay you, you're keeping up. They announced yesterday you can buy airline tickets with your Venmo balance. doing a partnership with JetBlue. So how we use the payment products we have.

how we physically pay, whether it's with our thumb or just digital credentials. I just think it's gonna look much different in the future. And I think it's gonna accelerate probably pretty quickly in the next five years.

Jess Gaedeke (31:12)
Yeah. And those are the types of things that literally every industry should be thinking about because how people pay for their products and services and how they can sort of meet those consumers where they are, understanding those dynamics of payment are going to be key for any industry. So. We are on the importance of looking at that stuff, and I find it fascinating. Even my kids, like they don't know how to exchange cash. They don't. mean.

Ronda Slaven (31:29)
I appreciate it.

What am I to do with this money grandma gave me?

Jess Gaedeke (31:43)
that's actually kind of depressing. ⁓ we'll move to the final dig. This is all about you as a consumer, Rhonda. So feel free if you want, you can put the research nerd to the side or if it's who you are, just bring it along. What's the last product or service you bought on impulse?

Ronda Slaven (32:02)
Last week I was in New York City for work and I had an extra few hours and I made the bad decision of going down to Herald Square and popping in Macy's and I bought a new pair of shoes but I actually really needed them in my defense. So I have problems and so that's a very specific shoe I have to wear and I knew that Herald Square and Macy's if they didn't have it no one would and they did.

Jess Gaedeke (32:14)
Yeah.

There you go. They found you with the right solution at the right time. Is there a category or brand or maybe a product that you could rationalize any price point for? You just have to have it in your life.

Ronda Slaven (32:35)
I'm pretty simple gal, but you know, I do like my Brooks running shoes. Like no matter what price they are, if I need them, I don't really even look at the price because I know those are the ones that fit me and I love them. So I probably Brooks running shoes, maybe Jenny's ice cream. You can make the price of that point as high as you want. And I'm probably still going to buy the luxuries in life. Those are probably those are probably the two that stand out to me.

Jess Gaedeke (32:54)
You

Yeah, and there's emotional reasons for those. can tell. ⁓ Brands have distinct personalities, as we know. So what's a brand that you would date and what's the brand that you would marry? And they don't have to be the same brand.

Ronda Slaven (33:13)
⁓ date and marry. that's interesting. ⁓ Well, I would love to date Burberry. That would be nice. They can spend everything on me and just spoil me. And the classic high quality, I like that. Mary, would go a different direction. I'd probably say REI. I love just the adventurous, hiking, outdoorsy, laid back, but also high quality.

And colorfuls, I love their color, like logo is just the earth tone vibes. And so that's probably, I guess, I don't know. That's a hard one.

Jess Gaedeke (33:54)
No, it's hard to commit and you know, picking one is hard, but that's good. And I feel like you did a nice thread of this idea of national parks into your running shoes into REI. It's just kind of happened naturally and organically. So clearly you love insights. What keeps you inspired in this industry and in this job?

Ronda Slaven (34:15)
You know, just seeing the future researchers of tomorrow, seeing the next generation, I recently got the opportunity to work with my alma mater, Ohio University down in Athens, Ohio, and they have a consumer research group within their business college. And they did a fun project for me on Gen Z and just watching their passion and their talent and like, they're so smart and savvy. It's almost scary. Like, I don't think at that age I was that smart or interested, you know. ⁓

But they're just so on top of it. And I think it just made me feel good about the future generation coming up behind us ⁓ and just their analytical capabilities, how they're already incorporating data science and MIS and how it's all blending together. So the silos are already broken down for the incoming talent, right? Versus now, think current talent is trying to adjust and upskill and figure out how that all works together. That new talent is like.

They don't even see lines. It's just all the same thing to them, right? Insights are insights. So I'm really excited about that. And then, yeah, even my current team, like an up and coming talent and just watching how excited they get and seeing how we're having an impact on the business. we get to work on such a wide variety of projects too, that I think keeps it really interesting. And I know I'm a little antsy and probably need to keep variety in my life too, but I would say those things. It's just the variety of challenges we're trying to solve every day.

keeps us on our toes and then just the talent coming up is really impressive.

Jess Gaedeke (35:42)
Yeah. that's very cool. That's a great inspirational way to kind of wrap up our conversation. And as we do that, Rhonda, I think I've mentioned this to you the last couple of times I've seen you. But again, our relationship went goes way, way back. And I just want to coming full circle to how you introduce yourself as being a mom first and all that. When I had my first and I went on maternity leave, Heinz is one of my my biggest friends.

And I sent a baby picture to all of you guys like announcing that she was here. And you replied and just said, just know, I know you're probably right in the middle of it right now. Everything feels really hard and everything is going to be fine and you're doing a great job. And I just really remember that. And it's those little things that you form these relationships in this industry. And I'm just so glad that we still get to dance in the same circles and I get to still see you and talk to you. thank

Ronda Slaven (36:26)
Thank

you for being here. you for having me. This is fantastic. I love it. Thank you so much.

Jess Gaedeke (36:34)
That was really, really great.